________________________________________________________________________Richard S. Kem
were going, it was difficult sometimes to anticipate what they really wanted to know. So, it
was a long, evolving process.
Q:
I'm interested in that particular case with the encroachment. What was Gianelli's position on
that? I mean, it sounds like a clear violation of federal property.
A:
Well, it was never precisely stated, other than we were being too strict, and we were
demanding too much, and we weren't realistic. It stayed the same way, and we found out we
weren't getting anywhere. Bob Dawson came aboard, and he was a little more reasonable in
at least having a dialogue, so we could try to work a solution.
So, I'm not quite sure what Gianelli's position was other than it should be less than what we
were trying to execute. He never did state his bottom line. It was just his approach to unravel
it from where it was to an easier position.
Q:
This was recreational use, or were they residents?
A:
They were residents. There were houses on a street in the authorized flood pool.
Q:
Wow.
A:
There was also a trailer park and some barns. So, it was difficult; people did have money
invested. I mean, like most of the problems we dealt with, they were real, live problems
because real, live people had investments.
It might have been a nickel compared to the budget of the United States, but it might have
been their life savings. So, when you put real flesh and issues together, then they have to be
looked at that way.
Q:
Just while you were getting these visits and these questions, other divisions were getting
similar visits and similar questions.
A:
Yes.
Q:
So, at the headquarters level, then, for the whole Corps--I'm trying to tie this together--how
was that being handled? Or was it?
A:
You'd have to ask General Heiberg that because he and Alex Shwaiko, Lew Blakey, and
Bory Steinberg were the ones who were involved at the headquarters. My feeling was that
Gianelli also didn't start off by seeking any kind of a working understanding with
Congressmen Whitten or Bevill and his committee. As a consequence, he portrayed that
since he was the administration, he could establish certain policies, and that's the way it
would be. Of course, that's not the way it is in our government. There was some abruptness
in the interactions between the two, and you could get caught in the crossfire if you weren't
judicious. By judicious, I mean when somebody spoke to you about something, you had to
recognize that this was part of an issue, and we all, of course, were part of the administration.
Policies were policies and established procedures.
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