Ernest Graves
The governors. We had the governors of 12 states, and I went to call on most of them.
I went to call on all the ones that showed any interest in seeing me.
Q:
Were there some who didn't?
A:
Yes, there were some scheduling problems. I had one of the most fascinating meetings
with Governor Daniel Walker of Illinois. Bill Starnes, who was the division engineer of
the Ohio River Division, and I made a joint appointment with Walker because, of
course, the state of Illinois is divided on a watershed basis between the two divisions.
The day we went down to Springfield, Walker had a young man who was an Eagle
Scout who was supposed to be governor for the day. We started this meeting with
Walker, and Walker pretty well turned the meeting over to this Eagle Scout who asked
us about the environment. Then we had the press in. So we got the distinct notion that
Walker was not very concerned about the substance of the Corps' program, since he
had turned this meeting with Starnes and me into a public relations gimmick.
Other meetings with governors were more substantive. Some were definitely interested.
But the Walker administration wasn't particularly concerned about water resource
development in Illinois.
Q:
Apparently not. You mentioned that by the third year you had established your
credibility there within the Corps, within the division, and without. Were there any
groups with which you had trouble establishing your credibility, that was harder than
with others?
A:
I don't believe there were. Our efforts were more at cross purposes with some groups
than with others. We got along pretty well with the Environmental Protection Agency,
which was relatively new at that time and had an extraordinarily difficult mission.
We didn't really have credibility problems with them. We had differences of view about
who fitted in where. There was a power struggle going on between the Corps and EPA
with respect to the waste disposal business because the laws governing water pollution
written at the turn of the century had put the Corps in the controlling position. When
the revisions came along, the EPA was displacing the Corps, and there was a little
tension there as to who had the say.
For example, Section 404 of the Water Pollution Control Act gave dredge and fill
permits to the Corps. But by the time it all got sorted out, the regulations gave EPA a
veto power on permits in this area. So those things had to be worked out.
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